While I get the ‘Its not Trek’ criticism to some extent, I really enjoyed Discovery. Even if the whole time travel nonsense is a bit silly and obviously has plot holes and paradoxes aplenty, it was fun and kept me wanting to watch the end.
Should we have a Trek thread, in the off topic, in “Weather?”
It keeps coming up, and possibly to the detriment of other “Watching” convos.
I’d totally show up (not to pointlessly internet-argue, that’s upsetting, unproductive, and not-fun, and I just want to keep this topic open for new things without dominating the thread. I always have a desire to talk about Star Trek, and I’m afraid that I’m part of the problem.
OK, nevermind, I just made a new topic while I was writing this: Ten Forward: Decompress )
I am very conflicted about Game of Thrones.
I read the first book (p. 1996) on holiday in 2000. I dropped it in the sea when Ned was killed. I read the second book (p. 1998) in 2001 as soon as I got back to Britain. It wasn’t long that the third book was finally published, so I devoured it. I did a Joey and put the book in the freezer after the Red Wedding made me question is everything sacred or not.
I had to wait 4 years for the fourth book. I playtested the original CCG. I liked it a lot. During that time, with the Lord of the Rings things friends and I were saying that if they did a TV show of Game of Thrones it would be stratospheric. Also, we discussed some of our discomfort reading the books as we got older. The cruder side of it… The incest, rape, etc. This is stuff that makes me feel uncomfortable, and I should have guessed the tone from the first chapter. It’s not my idea of fun to see it on screen, presented as entertainment.
Then again, the actual narrative - taking the sex, incest etc. out of it - is actually very compelling. A study of power vacuums (he does it very, very well) in a world where there’s a much bigger battle to fight. He writes compelling characters. And I need closure.
The series aired in 2011, the same time the 5th book came out. I read it. I cringed. My now Dad-self and change in worldview meant I cringed a lot throughout it. The series now felt like it was titillation for titillation’s sake, and I don’t like it very much. For the TV show, I watched the first episode and thought, you know what? I don’t want to watch the gruesome bits. They’ve got to do at least 8 years of the show, surely he’ll finish it in that time? NO HE HASN’T THE INSERT EXPLETIVES HERE.
I can hand on heart say that I haven’t seen an episode of Game of Thrones since the first one in 2011 (the year my son was born) until last week. I know the book isn’t coming out. The show has dialogue that is utterly needless - “I thought I’d die aged 80 with a **** around my ****” - really? Really? - but I must have closure.
So I’m watching Game of Thrones Season 8, because I guessed who Jon’s parents were, I really wanted Tyrion to get revenge on his ghastly Dad, and Cersei’s insanity is compelling and I want to know how it all ends. 19 years I’ve been waiting for closure.
Wow. I’ve never heard of anyone feeling conflicted or confused by GoT before, especially if they’re trying to reconcile the show and the books
Remember, the show and the books decided they would branch off a few years ago, it just made sense for live action and print to go in different directions. They’re very different media, and RR Martin wanted to write books, while HBO wanted to make a series. (It didn’t hurt George that they would still pay him a lot of money no mater what he did).
The showrunners wanted to just try to keep true to the feel and characters of the books, while having to make things that made sense for a series, and GRRM wanted to write things that made sense for the books without having to worry about the complications that come from a big-budget show. So they diverged, and everyone involved is rolling in cash like Scrooge McDuck.
On my part, no complaints here.
I’m conflicted as I’ve grown older. My 20something self loved the first three books, but my now jaded 40something self doesn’t like the incest, rape, kind-of-spotty-teenager stuff. I’m not sure my 20something self did gloss over the morality problems entirely, I just find I could gloss over the morality problems. I can’t do that now, really.
Anyway, I’m watching the TV show to get closure and then I can sack the books off.
I feel you Funk. Watching/reading something like (for instance) Clockwork Orange when I was a kid made me feel edgy and awesome. I’m 45 now with kids, and I feel cringey and uncomfortable with it (still, undeniably a Kubrick masterpiece and a really weird Anthony Burgess read).
There’s a thing on TVTropes called “Adult Fear.” It’s like…well…
Horror movies and games are supposed to make you scared. Zombies, psychos, monsters, aliens…Stranger Things (in it’s own category, but there’s a lot of overlap, including with “Adult Fear”).
Adult Fear covers the real things you actually get scared about when you’re a grown-up. Strangers with your kids, abusive authority figures, bad traffic accidents, spousal abuse, impossible legal problems, getting robbed, cancer…and so on.
It can make stuff that used to seem fun a bit too real.
I think that’s true with a lot of things. Like the misogyny in hip hop. Did I really like 99 Problems? Listening to it now is bad, but the rhythm, sound and beat in that song is pretty great. Just ignore the words? I think in general misogyny doesn’t sit well in today’s society, and nor with me. I’m also more likely to speak about blatant misogyny in day to day life than I was when I was in my 20s.
Sorry I’ve gone off topic.
I think it’s worth talking about, especially since there are plenty of people making film in particular who clearly don’t regard sexism or racism as a problem.
I recently watched Spy, because one of my favourite film critics found a strong feminist undercurrent between the body-fluid humour. But I really didn’t: it’s not just that other people disrespect the protagonist, the film does too.
Yeah on paper GoT sounds like something I would like, but it seems to essentially be Scandal set in a high fantasy world, going from one “shock” to the another.
HOLY CRAP we got so serious here, this turned quick (I am also to blame).
I just caught up on What We Do In the Shadows. It’s not nearly as funny as the movie, but it’s still pretty amusing. I was really excited when I first heard it was going to be a real thing, but disappointed when I found out it wasn’t the original cast. Still, Clement and Waititi is a hell of a combo we need to keep an eye on, especially now that Waititi is probably richer than Croesus after Ragnarok.
Yeah, at some point GoT started to shock its audience just to shock them not so much for plot reasons.
And the show could dial down on the nudeness somehow without betraying its story
So are we all excited about Avengers: Endgame?
Because I am so excited! I dreamed about watching it last night, but I was just waiting in the theater watching the pre-show before the movie.
With all the records the pre-sales set I’m hoping it can knock Avatar off the top of the chart!
I am really excited to watch What We Do in the Shadows (tv), but yeah, it’s just not going be as good without Taika and Jermaine in the lead. Also it’s not on my usual streaming services (yet? will it ever be?) and that angers me.
@twispby, I am there with you, emotionally and mentally, sharing a big tub of popcorn. It’s only a matter of time before the movie plays…
we’ll be there!
Wow, that came off a bit creepier than I planned.
I am harrumphing, I’d never advocate unofficial streaming services if someone PM’d me for a link or three when the original service makes it a huge pain in the ass to watch. Harrumphing, I tells you! (Feel free to PM me).
DUNE David Lynch; 1984. I will brook no debate.
In contrast, I will debate no brook.
They just babble.
Yeah, thanks for reminding me of the sad GoT situation. I guess I also unconsciously gave up hope there’ll be a next book.
I just watched Han and enjoyed it.
I always liked the Star Wars universe, but didn’t really enjoy the Saga, so standalone movies might work best for me.
Rogue one next.
I really really liked Rogue One for a stand alone story and will hear no criticism about it.
To my pleasure and slight surprise, the S.O. watched Candyman all the way through with me last night. I was fully prepared for them to abandon it part way through, but it got its hooks in, so to speak. It’s a credit to how grounded the story stays, despite the subject matter. A genuinely fine horror film.
I’ve filed Marvel films under the same category as Star Wars films – there’s too many of them; they’ll never stop making them; I bailed out years ago.
The ones I’ve seen have been fine (I really enjoyed “Iron Man”), and I expect this one will be fine as well, but the thought of getting involved in what it’s all turned into is slightly exhausting, so I’m happier watching other things instead.