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I'm Out of the Box! (A safe place for gaymers)

To actually contribute to the topic:

And in addition, board games rarely are interested in telling stories. Narratives are rather used to convey a theme or act as a kind of lubricant for the mechanics.

In Freedom: Underground Railroad, you’re trying to free slaves, thus learning something about the real struggles of them during that time.
Maybe you could similarly try to find a number of goals to achieve that tell something specific about queer lives.

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Dangit, we got back on track before I got home from work. (almost)
I had A Poem if things got out of hand.


update:

You know what, here you go, anyway:

Take it to the Thunderdome
the place to go to bitch and moan
That place was made, built, and paved
for fourm members’ rants and raves
If you find the topic swerving off
vent your steam there, because I don’t have the fucking time or patience to find another rhyme, you know what you did.

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Can we please get back to things like queer gaming?

You are no longer in time out (you know who you are). Let’s get crackin’.

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So I have something I’d like to mention that I think is worth discussing.

I’ve been meaning to mention this game on here at some point but I recently played a game called Legacy: Testament of Duke De Crecy. The game is primarily about building a noble family in early 1700’s France, and I really enjoy it, but there is a particular mechanic in it that I enjoy more than anything. Like in many board games, you can pick whether your beginning character is male or female, but in this game the choice determines what resources you begin the game with (women start with more money, men start with more friends,etc.) This plays into the game in several different ways that mean that the experience is different for those who are women and those who are men. Then I began thinking wondering if something similar could be done with LGBTQ themes.

For example, in most RPG’s nowadays, at some point you are allowed to decide who to romance. What if for example, you (playing as a woman) romance another woman, but in doing so, you change how other members of your party or members of society view you. This in turn could affect shops, quests, inns, etc.

I think this could be interesting in terms of exploring how a world views such people, what kind of difficulties LGTBQ people face in being themselves (in the game world and in the real world), etc.

So, what do you guys think? Know any games that do this already? Have any critiques or problems with the idea? Let me know!

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Wow, that may be a little hard to get, although I have seen it as:
"Dziedzictwo
Testament
Diuka de Crecy"
with excellent reviews for the English translations!

I must learn more…

Perhaps what I find most interesting is that marrying people in the game is also tied up in your resources. Marrying a man means you have to pay a dowry of some amount, but marrying a woman gives you a dowry. It ends up creating an interesting historical parallel in that having male children is preferred.

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Dowry. What the hell’s a dowry?

Does anyone still do that these days? I mean, interesting game mechanic, sure. But outside from that, irl, what the what?

Also, in the game, can you play a gender that can marry the same gender? I know, in eighteenth century France you historically couldn’t do that, but to the rules allow for any same-gender alliances?

No. Which I think was intentional in that they wanted to make the game rooted in history.

A dowry is some amount of money that is given to the groom or groom’s family for marrying the bride in question. And yes, in some countries it still exists, along with lots of dowry-related violence towards women (thanks for that depressing fact Wikipedia).

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Kind of related: does anyone have any queer house rules for games?
I’ve already mentioned removing the gender restrictions from Tales of the Arabian Nights, so you can court who you like and can still win the game if you transition (although players can set their own goals if they like).

The only other thing I’m aware of is in Fief 1429 where people make gay marriage legal, (which also allows for more alliances, which is more fun.)

Is there anything worth adding to other games? Or do people always buy the historical accuracy line?

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It’s kind of a blanket house rule of any game we play (at least at my house). It started with doubling pink/blue pegs in the front seat in The Game of Life when I was a kid.

Wow. I just realized I can probably get other colors 3D printed… yes, I should do that…

(PS edit: for anyone who was wondering, I do know what a dowry is, I was raised Catholic. I just wanted @ghost8b8 to talk more about this interesting game, which I haven’t been able to find anywhere locally. It hard to do a game that’s based on history, when inside you keep wanting to say “at the very least, step up to the 1990’s!” even though it would mess up the accuracy. See all the (2, I think?) games that the lads have reviewed on the main site with unfortunate racism, to contrast and compare).

Edit AGAIN: [quote=“AlabasterC, post:132, topic:1978”]
Is there anything worth adding to other games? Or do people always buy the historical accuracy line?
[/quote]

I am going to say: if it does not detract from play mechanics, but detracts from flavor, it should always be a house rule in every house. If it doesn’t detract from flavor or mechanics, it should be mandatory (well, not mandatory, but at least very seriously considered).

Oddly, I actually prefer Fief as a game with only male-female marriages. It adds more value to ladies (who don’t add to combat until they have a title) and leads to cynical trading. Oh, your two houses are sausage fests? Well I guess I could sell you one of my daughters if you make it worth my while. Oh you only have daughters, but only need one for a political marriage? I guess I could trade you my big strong fourth son so you have someone to lead your armies, for your useless third daughter.

Throw in the political expansion with traits and flaws and you get a surprisingly apt representation of 15th century nobility where human life has a quantifiable value

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I was so close to a straight flush of privileges, sooooo close. I’m male, white, cis-gendered, middle class, fit, with no physical or mental disabilities, not to mention, I own a dog (which is always a privilege, dogs are so blessed.)

But then gayness happened. I was thirteen when I realised, playing Grand Theft Auto, as many thirteen-year-olds do, with my older brother. He had some generic comment about the ‘hotness’ of one of the female characters, and for the first time I was hyper aware that I did not feel the same way. Not about her, or any other girl… ever.

A few years of rejection and denial passed, I went through my Call of Duty phase, and various other bad games, and eventually I accepted being gay, and I bought Skyrim. I married Vorstag btw, I like to think he helped me figure myself out.

I did have one particularly memorable bad interaction. I was in a Dungeons and Dragons campaign with a few friends I knew well, and a couple more I didn’t so much. The DM was a bit of a dick, but I found his extreme nerdiness very amusing, so I let it slide.

Anyway, so we came across some bandit leader, and my character spear-headed negotiations (as the silver-tongued rogue), but he wouldn’t allow me to roll to seduce the bandit leader. Which was fine on its own, you know, DM’s have rules- I was ready to just laugh it off and leave it there.

Then he had to elaborate that he would not allow me to seduce that bandit leader because we were both men. And tried to tell me that DND lore does not allow for homosexuality. It was incredibly uncomfortable, suddenly I didn’t feel like playing very much.

This site is the first one that’s ever looked inviting to me. Over the years, I’ve been on many online chat forums about gaming, comics, and other such nerdy things that appeared to me (at least when I was a teenager) to be dominated by straight men. I never came out to them, or any of my gaming friends IRL. It never felt safe to do so. I’m ‘out’ to my family and a lot of my friends, but when I’m in any kind of nerdy/gaming circle, I just don’t say anything. So I’m glad this places exists.

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Hey, @TheGoldenAvenger Rule Zero should never apply to real life. That DM was incredibly wrong.

D&D never had anything explicitly against homosexuality, and today, specifically has language that addresses sexualites and gender identities.

I’m sorry that you had such a terrible experience with something that has actually been one of the greatest joys of my life. It should have been yours, too, if that hadn’t happened. I’m ridiculously happy that you have found us.

Welcome.

You are welcome here.

I’ll let you have the beanbag chair. But just until I get back from the store! Then I want it back!

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Well, it does in 5th edition. From the rules:

You don’t need to be confined to binary notions of sex
and gender. The elf god Corellon Larethian is often seen
as androgynous, for example, and some elves in the
multiverse are made in Corellon’s image. You could also
play a female character who presents herself as a man,
a man who feels trapped in a female body, or a bearded
female dwarf who hates being mistaken for a male.
Likewise, your character’s sexual orientation is for you
to decide.

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I remember reading that in 5e and I almost cried in front of strangers and family.

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Thank you so much :slight_smile:

I seriously doubted he was telling the truth, but I certainly didn’t have the knowledge to dispute him. It’s okay though, since then I’ve played D&D with much friendlier, less rigid DM’s and had the time of my life.

Thank you
And I will happily take your beanbag chair, but I will not be held responsible for returning it. You can keep the new one :smiley:

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Aw, jeeze, I just got that old beanbag chair broken in!

An idea! But possibly too late. Who’s at SHUX? Is there any interest in a meet up?

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It was a Good Idea.

Next time!